I have completed the C22 keel project.

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astrorad
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I have completed the C22 keel project.

Post by astrorad »

I will post the links to my two videos of the keel project in the keel topic tab...for anyone interested in how I did mine.
Bill
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Post by OutnBacker »

Once again - a valuable addition to a growing library of knowledge on these boats. Thank you, Astrorad
Current: '75 Montgomery 17 #65
Current: '78 Chrysler 20
Past: '78 Chrysler 22
'98 Bauer 12 - gaff rig
'78 Orion Malibu 18
Forever: '83 Grumman 17, gunter rigged with jib and trimaran outriggers.
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Matt & Star
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Post by Matt & Star »

Hey Bill- congrats on completing the daunting keel pin task. I think I'll be tackling the job in the spring, and like you, doing it mostly single-handed. Free Ride is now an empty shell- all stripped, de-siliconed and ready for fixing, filling, fairing and painting (topside only this year). It's unbelievable how long it has taken just to get to this stage! (The Devil is in the details, after all.)

This forum is an indispensable resource for all of us Chrysler owners, and contributions like yours as well as all those from other members really ease the burden and eliminate the mystery of fixes we'll all have to face when the time comes.

Thanks to both you and everyone else that has taken the effort to contribute so much to the cause! I hope to add to that list myself when the snow starts flying and I can finally focus on compiling the countless photos and vids into something useful.

Cheers!
Matt
1980 Chrysler 22, "Free Ride", on the hard gettin' pretty.
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Post by astrorad »

Before I started the project I had quite a bit of anxiety about how to tackle it safely. I reviewed past posts about how it was done by others...some methods that I thought were good and some not so good. I devised my method for the sake of safety...3000 lbs of boat over my head was not a welcome situation without the knowledge that it was securely supported. The key to success was careful planning, measuring and not rushing to get it done. One problem area was using a floor jack, as it does not lift completely vertically, but raises in a slight arc which causes the boat to want to creep as you raise it. Screw jacks and bottle jacks would be better, in that they lift completely vertically.
One other area of caution that I want to mention is that the screw type boat stands are designed to support side loads to keep the boat from tipping. The boat is supposed to be supported by the keel, which you cannot do with a swing keel boat like the C22. That is why I built super duty stand for the aft and forward sections of my hull.
Thanx to everyone for watching my videos and for any comments.
Bill
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Post by CaptainScott »

With all due respect Bill I totally agree with the word of caution using the screw type jack stands however I respectfully disagree that they can not or should not be used on sailboats this size! The issue is more with the user and the boat! Simply stuffing stands under a sailboat is a very bad idea because you can cause damage to the hull. However our wonderful Chryslers 22's have some nice thick hulls. They are easily supported with 4 stands! For our boats the key is to NOT put the stands so far to the sides that the are providing mostly lateral support! The stands could easily slip and cause a drop. IF used that way, they would need to be chained together. However properly used the boat stands are more than capable of carrying the weight our boats and boats substantially bigger!


Image

When supporting a larger sailboat, yes, the keel on the ground is a great idea, however, stands properly placed and chained together can also support the boat just fine. One key is to place them under bulkheads to prevent hull distortion. When placing stands on this boat the hull is tapped to find bulkheads which in turn offer strong support without hull flex due to the lighter layers of fiberglass and heavier weight. It is hard to see but the looking at the prop and to the right of it, the forward stand is chained to the stand on the opposite side of the boat. That is done because the lateral support really does suck! Further review and you can see the aft stands are also chained. Again, to keep the stands from moving!!


Image

Scott
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astrorad
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Post by astrorad »

Scott...I see that the stands that you used on your C22 are not the tilted style..they look very heavy duty and seem to be designed for direct underneath support...the stands in your Destiny picture are the normal side stands that you usually see people using...according to Brownell boat stand company they are only for lateral support with the weight of the boat on the keel as in your picture.
I have seen a few pictures of people using these lateral support stands for total weight support...that what concerned me. They seem to have gotten away with doing it, but I shudder whenever I see someone take chances with their and someone elses life. That was my only reason for bringing up the topic.
Thank you for your input on this important subject...I am not an expert by any means, but we must all use caution when working on our boats.
Bill
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Post by Matt & Star »

While working on the boat these past months I was pondering which way would be the safest to raise her off the cradle (IMHO). After reviewing other's methods, I had decided on welding up 2 heavy-duty "double" screw stands (symetrical non-lateral type)- each pair of stands physically connected to one another, and probably fabricated out of 1/4" x 2" angle or channeling similar to what Scott's stands are made out of. Kind of a hybrid between the screw stands and the one that you had made, Bill. Like you, I like the idea of something substantial such as four steel pyramids bridging the gap between the boat and my squishy body, especially with gravity acting the way it does...
I was thinking on using the engineered beam /cribbing method to allow clearance to pull out the cradle, then back it up with the stand. I'm even considering tying the double fore and aft stands together with removable bars/pins as I didn't know how stable it would be fore/aft once I was crawling in and out and removing the keel- probably overkill, but I'd rather err on the side of paranoid as it's supporting a double convex surface.

Granted, I'm a complete sailboat noob, and I'm sure it's fine, but every time I see keelboats supported by stands that aren't chained together, my rear puckers! It just doesn't look like they could handle any movement aboard the boat without shifting. (They seem so skinny, too, but I have a tendency to overbuild when it comes to something like this.)

Matt

(*edited "concave" to "convex". But y'all know what I meant, right? Haha! A concave monohull could cause an issue...)
Last edited by Matt & Star on Tue Aug 26, 2014 8:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
1980 Chrysler 22, "Free Ride", on the hard gettin' pretty.
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Post by CaptainScott »

I guess we'll have to agree to agree then Bill! LOL!

There are many different screw type stands and you must be aware of what each were built for and how to use them safely! Using only side screw stands to support the entire hull is nuts! Even with the 22'ers!

And yes, the stands under Lady Jo were built for a 20 ton vessel. Me being chicken, was extremely comfortable using them under Lady Jo! They were very heavy and I struggled loading them in my PU! LOL!

:mrgreen:
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Post by astrorad »

I discovered that you can pass your trailer under the beam that you are supporting the front of the boat with by using this technique. Lower your trailer hitch coupler low enough so the forward most part of the trailer bunk board is lower that the underside of the front boat support beam. Now measure the height from ground to the outside edge of the trailer bunk at the trailer axle.Iif it is about and inch lower that the underside of the support beam, it too will pass underneath. Two men can now lift the trailer coupler high enough to get the rear trailer bunk boards low enough to pass under the beam and as you move the trailer rearward under the boat you need to gradually lower the trailer tongue to provide clearance.
My support beam had 34 inches of clearance...and bunks at axle was 33 inches. The reverse process for removal of trailer...that way no need to remove bunk boards as I did.
Bill
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Post by C22Bob »

I posted back in April about these stands/cradle I built for about $150 for my keel restoration project. A welder is needed, but doesn't take a lot of skill.

Bob's Jack Stands

Image


I tend to agree with others that I would never rely on just the Brownell jack stands for support. I see it working for a lot of people on a lot of boats, but something about it just doesn't look right. Also, I read somewhere that insurance companies frown on that and push back, or won't pay on damage claims.
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Post by N41EF »

There should be a secret club for those of us who have changed keel pin brackets. T-shirt, certificate suitable for framing, maybe even a secret handshake.

I put my stern on a stack of cinder blocks, and used a constructed beam and two stacks of blocks to hold the front up. I had to drop my bunks to get the trailer to clear under the beam to pull it out.

Hope to NEVER have to do all of that work again.
1979 C22 S/V Client Meeting
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Post by astrorad »

I like that secret club idea...(whispers...hello Comrade of the Keel)...
Bill
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Post by CaptainScott »

astrorad wrote:I like that secret club idea...(whispers...hello Comrade of the Keel)...
LOL!
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